Today we interview Rose Coleman. Learn about her story of growing up in the industry and after years, switching from a boutique photography studio model to a volume studio based on club sports. She said no to overhead and yes to profit.
It is important for Rose and her husband to stay debt free. She shares some great ideas on how to have less debt and more profit. As Rose says in this episode, it is all about the money you keep not the money you make.
Rose is known for photographing athletes, sports, dancers, and gymnastics. Where she makes piles of cash is photographing 11 club teams in one night. Listen to her explain why this is such a profitable business model.
You can follow Rose on Instagram at @RoseColeman or @centerstageportraits and also on her website https://www.centerstageportraits.com/
Books from the Episode
Strength Finders 2.0 https://amzn.to/2PwMIcJ
Brendon Burchard https://amzn.to/2CkdlxW
Girl Wash Your Face https://amzn.to/2NH87hH
Matt’s Ant Farm YouTube side note:
Additional Free Resources at MattHoaglin.com
Speaker 2: [00:03] Welcome to from nothing to profit, a photographer’s podcast with Matt and Kia where each week they talk to photographers about what is working in their business now so you can swipe those ideas and grow your business faster. Today
Kia: [00:20] we are going to be interviewing Rose Coleman and rose has been part of the photography industry for over 18 years. I’m going to say more than that because she’s actually grown up in the industry and I’ve known her for forever it seems like, and I’m so excited to have her on here. She’s a as, as I said, she’s grown up in the industry and been a part of it, but what she’s done as a business owner, after her second child was born, she left behind the boutique studio business model and created a fast paced sports photos, photography company with her husband in 2015. She is known for her clean, beautiful work with dancers, gymnastics and athletes. And if you follow her on Instagram, you’ll see some of that amazing work. And just recently she and her husband purchased a five acre homestead that they are going to live on with their three darling children and they plan to create their dream studio there. So I’m assuming it’s going to go back somewhat to the boutique business model but still incorporate her love of sports photography. Is that true rose?
Rose: [01:31] Yes. We have been looking for a piece of commercial property and rent is very expensive and so kind of our business model has a lot to do with just our financials, like kind of more more of our decisions as we’ve kind of grown and evolved has been majority focused on like is this profitable enough? Like when we were in the large studios space, um, a lot of it went to general expenses and employees and overhead and upkeep of things. And as we continue to kind of move forward and we kind of gotten to a spot where it’s like we’re going to have in two years we’re going to have to have something and we rent only like two months out of the year when we need to have something. So we’ve always kind of known if we can get our hands in something local that has a home property, but also has a place for an exterior building, a metal building barns, something of that sorts with some land that was my ultimate dream and I’m kind of where we’re at those very expensive.
Rose: [02:32] So it’s like either commercial property or just can we evolve that into having it in a space or home. So, you know, most of our expenses would be, you know, linked into together and just be more efficient, be more profitable. So yes, we close actually next week on Friday and move into that building. It has five acres. I’m an older home that we’re going to fix up, but it has um, five acres and it has a barn because it was actually a ranch, like a horse ranch. And so there’s a 40 by 60 large barn, um, that they had stalls in and we’re going to convert that all into a studio space that we can shoot out of, you know, so we don’t have to use rent, we don’t have to continue to look for commercial property. Where are you guys located at? We are on the southwest side of Oklahoma City. Cool. Cool. Yes. This is so exciting.
Matt: [03:23] So one of the things that you mentioned in your bio that we didn’t mention roses, something about, um, kind of, you mentioned something about being debt free type of thing is so, and you were talking about finances when you just talked a second ago. So is, is that something you guys kind of focus on is definitely staying out of debt and does that kind of your thing?
Rose: [03:40] Absolutely, absolutely. We have not. I mean my husband will laugh and tell you that he married me. One of the main reasons is because I was debt free and everyone else has thousands and thousands of college dollar debt, a crew to them. But yeah, debt free is a big thing. Like we bought this and we’ve even talked about the piece of property, you know, it’s actually a 12 acre lot of land and work on a parcel off seven of it and sell it, you know, to cut down our expenses on that and then how we can get it actually paid off in five years. Like is that a doable thing? You know? So yes, debt free is huge to us it is all about the money you get to keep. I feel like when you work, especially when you work for yourself. And so that’s been a huge, huge focus on vest. So I mean we don’t have card debt. I mean we just, we just have our house debt now that we know it’s going to be larger, but we’re like very, very. It’s very, very important to us to have a debt free lifestyle and figuring out how to get those things paid off.
Matt: [04:35] Absolutely. Kind of makes fun of me all the time because when I married my wife Allison, I brought lots of debt to the Chi of, refers to me as the ultimate catch because definitely married up and not only looks but also obviously in the financial world as well. So.
Matt: [04:56] So real quick, kind of tell us what your expertise is or what you’re known for. Kind of talked about it a little bit and I’ve been on your website and seen some of your dancing pictures and stuff like that, but tell me a little bit about what you’re known for.
Rose: [05:08] So, um, I would say that I’ve known for shooting athletes and shooting sports. I come from a big portrait background in I love, I absolutely love and adore, but in the last few years it’s all been athletes. So we do a majority of dancers, gymnastics, volleyball players, anything that’s a club level sport, which in my world there’s either little leagues which are just the masses, you know, of like tee ball players. Then there’s club which is, um, a higher level like a parent is going to spend more money to put your kid in a club sport and um, we focus on that and then you have high school, junior high levels of the same kind of things. You could be a baseball or at high school you could be a baseball or in a club or you could be a baseball or in a little league, but we focus on club because there’s generally about, you know, at least 150 to 350 most often in a club sport.
Rose: [06:04] And those are people that have already, their parents are already paying a higher dollar to have their kid be in there. So, I mean, they’re already invested, you know, you’re going to get a sale from that and they all want photos because they’re invested in this. It’s just kind of the, the nugget we go for. So we shoot a lot of those. I do a lot of dance work. Um, my parents have a dance photography business. I still help them quite a bit with that. And um, a lot of gymnastics, a lot of volleyball, but club is really what we, what we’re known for and going for.
Rose: [06:41] Yes. Um, we do. We don’t do any little leagues. We have done one or two in the past and I’ve regretted it every time we are not set up because because it’s really important to us to operate as efficient as possible. Between Tim and I, we have a few people that will work contract for us to make an event happen. But most shoots, I mean most shoots I can roll out with myself, my husband and one other girl. So it’s like we shoot, he sells in one girl shows. So we tried to target, you know, athletes and clubs that we can fit that and run as efficiently as possible within our business. And that is keeping it as minimal as staff as we possibly can.
Rose: [07:26] Yeah. Um, it is really unique because there’s not a lot of people that I, I guess educate on club photography. So it’s, it’s been a big eye opener for me. Um, so when we roll out to a club, like for instance, I can do a, like a good size volleyball, I can shoot about 11 teams and an evening from about four to [7:30] and what each team of those is going to have 10 people on that. Samir, anywhere roughly about 120 to 150 kids depend on how many we squished in there and I can do that in a night and we shoot and show and sell that same night. Boom, boom, boom. Right together.
Matt: [08:08] That’s so interesting to me because I’ve been looking at doing some more volume stuff and figuring out what that looks like and I think it’s so interesting that you’ve like niche to out and just say, Hey, we do clubs because you’re right, you can do, you can do little leagues, you could do all the high school sports and everywhere in between. You’ve kind of found like, okay, clubs is where it’s at because the parents are invested and they’ve paid extra for the kids to be in there. They probably have a couple uniforms and stuff like that, so there’s already this culture that the money is flowing when you’re in club and I think that’s just super, super smart.
Rose: [08:38] Yeah, absolutely. A couple uniforms. It’s definitely true. My son has three different uniforms and he’s forgets them and then we’d get in trouble and all kinds of things. So expensive. I mean. Oh yes. They’re very. And so having them is not something that’s valuable for sure. Absolutely. So Rose Good. Just going back to that, are you the main shooter then for the club events? Yes. I shoot everything. So your husband is just like the male model at the shoe. I mean he has. He has the same job I have where you showed up. It looks good, right? Absolutely. Absolutely. He knows the questions. He is the Schmoozer. He is. It definitely fits into his strengths. He loves connecting with people. He could like make a friend with a wall very easily. He just like, I mean he, he is that person. They asked me about an order or paying a certain price and I’m like, go to Tim. He can, he’ll handle it for you. I don’t want to handle that. I don’t want to hear your story of why you don’t want to order tonight. No, go, go to someone else.
Rose: [09:47] You’re such a bleeding heart rose. It just makes me nervous. I’m like, I feel your story and yeah, I want to make do. And he’s just like, no. Yeah, you’re going to order to. You’re going to see him. You’re going to order him tonight. Right now. Duh, Duh, Duh. Like he, he handles that very well. So yes, I do all the photography. That’s awesome. That’s great. So, so rose been in the business for as long as you have and seeing that from, you know, from your mom being a photographer to being in a family business, to now running your own portrait business. Tell us the story of what is working now for you or share one of your greatest ideas that you’ve had today and how you’ve turned that into a success. Either way, I probably can meld the two together, so when we decided after I had my second child, I took a year off and I did a handful of sessions, but I really did not end up thinking I was going to get back into photography.
Rose: [10:39] I was just like, what’s working? Really? Yeah. I did not think I was. I got. I did not know that part time job at our church and ministry and very part time and when we had my daughter I was working all the time, obviously working with informed my parents and I was kind of working all day, going home at night, eating, schmoozing, talking, put your kids to bed and I would go right back to work because I lived right behind our commercial. I bought a house right behind our commercial space so I would go back there and I was working till midnight and it was a good year and I mean right before I had her that I was just like, this is like I’m working to death. I’m working all the time and if I was making tons of money then I could kind of justify that like okay, do it for a season, rocket hard, do it hard.
Rose: [11:25] But I wasn’t because obviously I was working with my family and we had like four or five employees at that time and I was just like, I’m just, I’m the person that has to say and get it done. If no one else wants to get it done when you work for yourself. So when I had her I was just like, I’m not going to go this level anymore. So I kind of obviously told my parents. I was like, I’m, I’m out, I’m done. This is not working for me anymore and I’ll help you if you need something done, but I’m just, I’m out of this. I’m going to be with my kids for a little while and I never really had a desire to be a true stay at home mom, but I was just like, I’m taking time out. I’m just, I’m just done.
Rose: [12:00] Really didn’t think I was going to get back into it. And then my daughter is a year and my husband’s kind of like, you got, you got to get baby, you’re going to get back to where we lived off of your money for a long time, even though it wasn’t a ton, but I mean it still contributed to our family and you know, we, we did a lot of things raw, revolved around our business, my business with my family. And I was just like, I don’t want to do this the same like I love studio work, but I don’t want to have to get a piece of property. I don’t want to be like everyone else that does these little mini sessions, you know, at such a cheap rate. I was like, that’s so much work. I was just like, I don’t know what I want to do, if this is what we have to do.
Rose: [12:40] And then, um, we. So we obviously prayed about a lot, thought about a lot, like you have to do something. So what does that going to be? Are you going to go into ministry? And I wasn’t really feeling like both tim and I could work in ministry together beside each other. I was just like, I don’t know. I don’t know. And obviously there’s so much potential and I have so much education in photography. Like I should, you know, I’ve, I honestly, God has given me this opportunity. I know all this stuff. Like I need to move forward with that. So we took some time to figure out what that looked like and bounced around ideas because I’m kind of like an overdue or a little bit. And I was like, okay, what makes the most money? What can we do to live the lifestyle that we want to have?
Rose: [13:20] What can we do to not have a studio location? What can we do to keep as much money in our pocket? And I got to spend a lot of time a long time ago with Ralph from Maghera and New Orleans and I shot for him upon a lot of locations and weekends I’d fly in and do work for him. And, and he was like, the people that make the most money in this business do volume. He’s like, at some level they do volume. It’s not about the $3,000 sales, it’s the $30 sales every five seconds. It’s just, that’s what they do. And he’s like, you won’t hear a lot of them because those people are too busy making money. They don’t educate. And I was like, okay, well yeah. And Ralph from Maghera to give backstory. He’s been the president of PPA, right? Yes. And he has a family business in New Orleans that does volume and portrait.
Rose: [14:07] Yes, he does both and I, I had a great opportunity to fly down there on many occasions and shoot his proms and shoot underclass for him and do some things. And so I was just like, I mean, and then at the end of the day, I mean like we come back to the house, obviously I’m with his family and got to stay with his family and it’s just like buckets of money, you know, just like, just like, okay, everyone has to open up the envelopes. Everyone’s sorts evident like we get this done tonight and I was just like, cash, you know, and it’s just like, this is what, this is how we do it. And I was just like, you know, when we’re revamping like, okay, what are we going to do? And I was like, we need to do some level of volume. I think this is what we need to do right now.
Rose: [14:43] It’s very saturated in the like family market right now. I don’t think that’s a way we need to go. This would allow us not to have a studio. And so we just kind of in October 2015 were like, okay, we’re going to build a sports photography business, we’re going to try this, we’re going to give it all that we got. And um, so that allowed us to not have a studio location except for a couple months out of the year. We don’t have to have staff, we have some contract people that we can pay per job to go out and do what we want to do. Um, I actually started with someone that I was going to before Tim came into the business. I started with another person that was a friend of mine and kind of worked together and then kind of had really to make very tough decisions to let her not be a part of the business anymore.
Rose: [15:31] And then Tim came on like a year ago and just constantly our decisions of like, how do we keep this efficient, how do we keep this, you know, as smooth as possible. How do we keep as much money as profitable? Because I mean, your, your PPA benchmark is going to say for every dollar you need to have $35, thirty five cents in your pocket. You know, I was like, how can we make that twice as much, you know, that’s not having overhead, that’s not having expenses, that’s not having an employee. So don’t try to do everything in the world. I’m not trying to be a sports photographer. Everything. I want to go for club levels that make you know, 10 or $15,000, you know, a job and work those into the business. Then that way we don’t have to and we can keep the lifestyle that we want to have. Does that make sense? Yeah, absolutely. Okay, thank you rose. So now are we going to take a break?
Matt: [16:20] Yeah, we’re. We’re going to take a break real quick because I just heard that rose needs to count her a bundles of money was what I heard. So we’re gonna take a quick break and she can count her bundles and then we’ll come back and we’ll do some find out what she’s fired up about in the industry and do some light and around stuff as well. So we’ll be right back.
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Matt: [18:08] So we’re with Rose Coleman and we’re talking about her business model where she works with a sports clubs. I guess it would be club sports and we’re just joking before the break that she’s found a way to make it super profitable. So along that same lines, what rose, what are you fired up about in the industry or what are you paying attention to the industry right now? No,
Rose: [18:28] I would say I am fired up about like helping people, like see their dreams. I, you know, I’ve been in this for so long and I know so many people that have been photographers or been in this for a long time that as I’ve just gone through a very, a very intense, you know, couple of years of like me being stressed at Mi fam, like this isn’t working. You know? And I mean we had a very beautiful big business. I mean, my largest sale was $21,000 on a high school senior me I shot sold. I mean like I know that that business model works, but for what we were doing and how we’re trying to manage it was just like for me in that season it was just like draining and sucking the life out of me. It was like I’m done. And then kind of getting back into it is just seeing other people that have been in this for a long time, you know, either make a change and get like, hey you need to make more money.
Rose: [19:19] You’re working too hard, you need to make more money. And there are things that I think people can change that, you know, like for instance, you don’t have to sell everything on the planet just because the labs can offer it. Like we don’t even use hate to say this, but we, we print everything in house. We don’t do that because we’d like to be come like a lab is because our cost of sales could be anywhere from four to eight percent rather than being, you know, 15 to 25 percent, you know, being super efficient so you can work a job and then keep as much money for yourself and your family as possible. So I would say like I’m super fired up to to see people accomplish their dreams and like make new changes and stepping into new directions and just be more efficient, be more profitable because I think that’s huge adversely as we have now three kids and I’m like, we need to make as much money as possible.
Rose: [20:09] They’re expensive. Kids are expensive. I was like, Tim realize man, my eight year old is like the size of a 13 year old and I’m like, I can’t be, I can’t feed you enough and I can’t clothe you anymore. You’ve got to. Well, especially if you’re going to put them in club sports. I’m like, everyone’s like, how old is he? And I’m like, no, he’s only eight. And they’re like, he’s really tall. I’m like, I know his grandmother’s six two, it’s just he’s going to be real tall, like they’re expensive. And so for me it’s being as profitable as possible. Also, you know, I was uh, something I, I keep my eye on is just kind of imagery. I don’t spend a lot of time looking at other people’s stuff. There’s a handful of people that I follow on Instagram, handful of people that I follow, like on social media, things that I just followed because I’m like, these people are what I consider to be the best of the best.
Rose: [20:56] Either they’re great in business or their imagery is outstanding and I don’t get oversaturated with the mundane of everyone shooting everyone or shooting the same places. I don’t even really follow anyone local in my area because it just doesn’t pertain to me. But yeah, just keeping, keeping up with that and what people are saying on social media because I think that we’re gonna see even more and the next five years that social media and imagery as far as their online presence is just changing. It’s changing the way that we have to do business. And what, how we have to sell it to people and I’m not against change I am for doing it, but to do it in a way that’s profitable.
Matt: [21:33] Okay. So let me, let me back you up real quick because I think that was great. But one of the things you mentioned was you, that you do a lot of printed in your house and I think that’s just going to raise a question. Just a few specifics about that. Like what that looks like. Are you guys printing like on inkjet printers? Um, just, just real quick kind of what does that look like because I don’t think our listeners have heard that very much.
Rose: [21:55] Yes. We have everything in house. I’m like 90 percent of our stuff and we print on a Fuji Gdx, 100. We’ve got two of them, so is kind of. I’ve got always had eight by 10 paper in it once. Always got like four by sixes in there. And we switched out with five by sevens and I mean the cost of doing research on it yesterday. Just figuring out because we need to purchase another one if we’re going to get something different or keep with the same thing and the cost of a four by six is less than twenty cents. I mean I think a five by seven is twenty one cents and then an eight by 10 is, is less than a dollar 50. I mean when you, you price out the ink and the printing the paper and everything that comes out. Okay.
Matt: [22:35] Yeah. And one of the things that’s really interesting about efficiency too is like when we do volume stuff, we send it all off to the lab and then it comes back and then we have to sort it. So almost like if you’re printing your own, you’re almost sorting and printing at the same time. And so there you’re like almost a removing a step, which I think saves you time too, which is pretty cool.
Rose: [22:54] Absolutely. I mean like, it’s interesting because you, I mean I can sit here and just print out somebody order a package, you know, put it in the little glass scene, put it in their mailers. So we’ve got super efficient. How we’ve got a setup, so I mean it’s just like one step to the next step, so the next step because the printer is pretty fast. I mean I can just package it, put it in and we’ve got our shipping station, how it is, so it just goes one, two, three. So we try to only sell products that we can handle in house. Like we even have a metal key chain maker. We’ve got a button machine which is super easy because a lot of people in sports love buttons and then Peel and stick magnets all just very easy that we can print package and ship the same day because part of our business model is turning around. We turn around digital’s 48 hours, we turn around images prints usually within a week. So we’re like super fast so we want to be able to print it, ship it, get it out.
Rose: [23:46] we’ll go through some of those things. So the first question we have is what was holding you back from becoming a full time photographer? I feel like you answered that a little bit because you actually started out as a full time photographer. Then took some time off and came back. So maybe talk about just coming back. I’m coming back. What was holding me back probably was just I’m in this business. I have not found many. I’ve been very fortunate with my parents both being involved in photography that I’ve, they’ve only hooked me up with really people that I feel like our amazing image creators or really good business people. I’ve had those kinds of wonderful opportunities holding me back was getting back into it and going like as I’ve worked for 15 years in the boutique business model with employees, with staff, with overhead and um, worked for someone else when I do it, do I want to work all the time, like how to balance family and my children are little and I think grandchildren get a little bit bigger.
Rose: [24:48] That’s a little bit of a different story. But as my babies are, are tiny right now, like how do you balance. And I know that in my heart I didn’t want to be a full time mom, but I did not want to work full time and I needed a full time income, you know, it’s like I want to make full time money, but I do not want to work full time hours in, in the kind of feeling that I did as a small child that my mother worked all of the time. She just worked night and day all of the time. It was either shooting or she was behind the computer having to work on imagery and I was just like, I don’t want that for my family. I really want to be infused in my family. I want my family to, you know, get the most from obviously the Lord and what they’ve been given and gifted.
Rose: [25:27] But I want them to be, you know, guided by me and Tim and our home. So I wanted to have as much time with them as possible. So I would say holding me back was that because it has to do with profitability. Like you can work to death, you can work all the time. And the more you work, you could find yourself needing more staff or needing a bigger building or needing more equipment because like every, it’s funny because every new type of athlete we ended up doing, we had to buy almost a new piece of equipment for it. Like we did, we had to do football this year. Okay. Well instead of our backdrop, we had to buy turf. Turf was expensive. I was like, do I want, you know, it was just like, well that’s $300, but that’s $300, you know, that’s $300 that I don’t get that back, you know, and we’re going to have.
Rose: [26:09] And then we did a large team. Well we needed more turf, you know, it’s like everything kind of led to like another little purchase. And I was like, we probably need to not do that. We need to stick with what is successful and we have all the equipment for until we’re ready to make some other moves of growing and stepping into another realm. And that’s, you know, it’s all. So I would say just for me getting back with me and being profitable, having to make really hard decisions with like not doing everything, not shooting everything but being as profitable as possible so I can spend as much time with my family as possible. So you saw your mom and I think most people of her generation really lived to work and you wanted to figure out how to work so that you could live the life that you wanted to live.
Rose: [26:54] Absolutely. My mom was, I mean she’s just a goer. She’s a doer. She’s not a person that likes to stay at home and just kind of take it easy. She worked very hard and I learned from her that like if you want something in life, you’re going to have to work for it. She came, she got divorced very young. She started wrote photography, wedding photography, and I learned I’ve got to see her be as broke as humanly possible and then build a business, become debt free herself. Like pay off her house, be debt free and then, you know, send their kids to, you know, do whatever they want to do. I mean, I got to see her without any help of anyone. She, she became that success herself. And so I know I got to see that that took a lot of time and a lot of work because I was basically photography.
Rose: [27:40] There are some people that are just banking huge amounts of money and there’s a lot of people just making a really good, nice part time income or barely a fulltime income. There’s not a lot of people that just run into just a rocking awesome business, you know, but so yeah, I got to see that, but I got to see that a little bit at the expense of her being home. And um, we just kinda had to learn why you just got to live with it, you know, this is, this is life and I have a great respect for her. Working it as hard as me. But I just knew that for me, I wanted to figure out there’s got to be a way to do both. You know, there’s gotta be a way to do both well without having to sacrifice one or the other.
Matt: [28:21] So. So one of my questions, because you keep talking about profitability, one of my questions that is this is an interesting question and the fact that like are you and your husband aligned with that? Like obviously he’s going to want to make profit, but is he more of a spender than you are or are you more of a spender? Are you guys pretty pretty together on all that? Because I’ll give you, I’ll get, I’m the, I’m the spender and allison is let’s save or like I’m like, we need that. And she’s like, do we really? I’m like, yes. I’m like, not only do we need a 10 by 10 thing of turf, we need to make, we need hundreds and hundreds of feet of turf. And she’s like, okay.
Rose: [28:56] Yeah, we um, it’s funny. I am definitely the spender when it comes to equipment. I love all the kitchen, like the gadgets, anything like I’m like this is awesome. I’ll like listen to podcast or like when I’m editing, be watching videos and reviews of things, of things that I want to have. And um, so definitely when it comes to photography world, when we, we’re spending money, we’re spending good money were spent more buying high quality things were not getting cheap on it. But as far as our lifestyle Gome goes, my husband is definitely the spender. We love like a value of ours. We love to travel together. We took I think like seven trips this past year. I mean we love to go to Disney world. I mean like we spend money on experiences like we don’t spend a lot of money, I would say on materialistic things, but we spend money on experiences like with our home group and our friends and make sure they feel loved and cared for and that way.
Rose: [29:46] And then we spend money traveling. Like that’s just a huge value of us. So we kind of meet in the road a little bit because like we had, for instance, we, I surprised him on father’s Day with a very small two night trip to Disney world with our big kids. I’m like, we’re going to get up at the crack of dawn, we’re going to go to nights, come back. And I planned it for September and um, I was like, but I gave him the tickets and stuff on father’s day and lo and behold, like a week later he’s like, I extended the trip like a good five days. So he’s like, so we’re going to be there like six days. And I was like, I had to pay for everything was paid for the tickets, the everything was bought. And he’s like, yeah, but it’s so much. Why go to days when you can go five? I’m like, oh,
Matt: [30:30] that conversation right there is the epitome most conversations allison and I have. It’s like, well why do it this? When we can do it 10 times bigger? And she’s like, do, do we really need to do that? I’m like, yes, we do.
Rose: [30:42] Yeah. I was like, man, this is. I had it paid for like it was done and I’m like, you’re going to make this and we’re not taking the little kids. So obviously the little kids going to be traumatized in our family because I was just taking the big kids because you didn’t need a stroller with that. That was my plan. But, so yeah, I would say he, he definitely, I mean we, we spend a lot of money together, but we spent an unexperienced toys and stuff that’s been official but fun, you know, for our family. So
Rose: [31:20] Best Advice I’ve ever received. Probably. I mean I’d probably have to go back to Mr Ralph and him saying that the people that are the most profitable are the people that do volume. I mean that changed my life. I probably never would have gotten into volume without it, without seeing that and kind of experiencing it and just feeling like Whoa, you can. It’s not all about tiny, tiny little leagues like a monk. You can make good money. So I would say that. And the second would be um, my mom, you know, shooting show, shooting show, do not put anything on the Internet, you know, like in, that is a crazy world right now. Obviously like if you, if your parents are, they’re showing their pictures and if you can’t, you got to be able to make that happen. And so we have evolved in our business to still not really put much stuff online.
Rose: [32:10] We do if we have to, but if a parent is going to be there, we’re shooting and showing immediately so the process is still fast, but if they don’t like their pictures, they reshoot it, they order right then and there and it’s done. So we don’t have to walk away going. Everyone in the planet is going to see their pictures up online and then maybe order or have a very small percentage of a buy. Right. We have very high by. Right. But it’s because of that. So I would say those two were the biggest set of affected my business. So you’re saying that you do in person sales? Yes. With your. Okay. Okay. That’s exciting. Or the parents, they’re on photo night with a club like. Yes. Yes. At Club level parents are there? Yeah. I mean we barely, we don’t do a lot of events.
Rose: [32:57] It’s normally high school. We have to shoot a high school team or something of that case where parents are not going to be there because we’re coming at a practice or something. Then we have to do a prepaid thing where then they do see pictures up online or they can prepay at that, but they have to buy into something to be able to do that. It’s not the way that I like to go because I’m obviously you just have a higher by rate and achievement level with that because parents are. Their parents are there. They’re going to buy their pictures. You know, our packages, our packages are not very expensive. Our highest package I think is $55, so I mean they’re, they’re, they’re invested in club that obviously spend money to have their kid in club. We’re going to, we’re going to show your pictures so they don’t do anything pre.
Rose: [33:37] We shoot everyone. They show it and then they, they sell. I mean they sell and then they turn in the order form with their payment to tim. So it’s super efficient, super lean. They don’t have to set up a lot of stuff. You know, but yes, we want to shoot and show everybody. Okay, so my question for you actually, I have a piece of advice just to stick in here is your kids are actually going to need you more when you’re. When they’re in high school, junior high and high school in my opinion, when they’re little, like they don’t really notice if you’re gone all the time, like obviously you want to be with them and you’re wanting that time with them, but when they come home from school, I love being home like three or four days a week because they come in the door and they talk and they told me about their day and you don’t get that time any other time.
Rose: [34:21] So just a, I don’t know. As a mom, I know you’re like wanting to live the life that you’re wanting to live and having teenagers myself, I’m so thankful that I can create my business so that I can be there when they walk in the door after school. So that’s interesting because tim and I were just. I love that and Tim and I were just driving by the property that we had state and we’re like, what are we going to do with a barn? Like we have an opportunity to have a studio space, how do we use that during kid hours at school to be profitable, but without, you know, it’s like, what does that look like? Does that look like starting some sort of smaller kid business, you know, does that, what does that look like? Is that a headshot business? I mean like an avenue that doesn’t affect our sports business, but it’s something that we can do without, you know, jeopardizing more time with our kids.
Rose: [35:10] I mean like we’re thinking and praying about that a lot because I’m like, I want to be, I want to do that well and I want to do it right because I want to have as much time, you know, after school when they get home as possible. That means so much and I don’t think you have to be there all the time, but just keeping that in mind. Okay. So here’s another question for you. Share one of your personal habits that you think contributes to your success. Oh Gosh. You know, I asked him about this. I was like, Tim, do you think I have any good habits? And he’s like, he’s like, you’re not a very habitable person. He’s like, this is hard because I was. Because I was like, what habits do I have? I don’t know. And he’s like, he thinks that I’m a very driven person, that he would say I think one of the habits that I have and he would agree, it’s just that I’m very driven and so I’m good enough is not good enough for me and that can be a good or a bad thing.
Rose: [36:04] Um, but I definitely think that it has contributed to my success. Absolutely. Because as, let’s say for General in sports photography, there’s a lot of really bad sports photographers. A lot of them, there’s more bad ones than there are really good photographers and I don’t really go into people’s backstories, but my story is different obviously because I come from a photographic porsche world and I know how to make really good imagery without having to have really flashy composites or digital backgrounds or things like that in the more I see stuff I see in the sports world, it’s like really kind of plainly flatly lit, you know, athlete on a very high grungy, edited background and that is something that we have stayed away from because I don’t want. I want our images to stand out on like a black or white or even out on the field, but just be dynamically lit, beautifully captured and not edited to, you know, high heavens.
Rose: [37:04] Like I just, I don’t need it to have graphics and artistry. I mean we do banners, we do some fun stuff, but I mean there’s only in my world, I mean like you’ve got your Richard Start Events, you’ve got your amazing people that spend hours creating something masterful that looks real and it doesn’t look fake. You know? And then you’ve gotten sports, a lot of people that are just like shoot and burn, dropping a green screen and it’s just very, it’s to me it’s overdone. And so as, as my attitude a lot is good enough is never good enough. I want to be the absolute best at what I do. I want my imagery to look absolutely the best that I can do in our area, in something that will just make it stand out. So I would say that that would just my driven. You have a habit of excellent.
Rose: [37:51] Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Might be hard to say about yourself, but I would definitely, I would definitely say that how you like your $20 bills stacked at the end of it just as long as they’re hidden away from my husband. So he’s like, where is this? What is this from? I’m like, Oh yeah, we wanted to install stack the mindset. The bigger the better. So whatever we’re just picking on, you know. Yeah. Is there an internet resource that you would recommend to our listeners? Um, yes, absolutely. So something that I think is important to me, I would say an inner inner net resource and a book like Combo, those two together. And I think something that is fundamentally changed the way that I see myself to see how I see hiring on other people, bringing people onto our team, working with other people is I’m a internet resources or a book that’s called strength finders. Two point zero. Have you guys ever heard of it? Yeah, we heard of it.
Rose: [39:04] No, it’s stopped at Dave Ramsey. We went over this. Oh no I don’t. I don’t get on the. I’m actually, it’s funny. I don’t, I love to read. I absolutely loved reading and I think that improving yourself. I don’t think I’ll ever get to a place where I feel like I am just the best of the best and I don’t have anywhere to learn. Like I want to be always cultivating an attitude of like humbleness and like there are amazing people. There’s madison guidance out there like learn, learn, learn. So I um, my husband has been in ministry for a very long time and um, he did this test a long time ago and it’s, you know, it’s a personality tests and, but what’s unique about it it, it focuses only on your strengths. So it strengths finders two point zero and you can read this book and you can take a test on it.
Rose: [39:51] What is interesting about it is I think especially at Kira said as women, it’s sometimes not easy to like brag about yourself, realize what you’re really good at. Cultivating that attitude of like, okay, I’m really great at this and be able to say that. I think that people feel bad about that. I think other women judge that it’s hard for some. Absolutely. Absolutely. You know. And so this test we took this test, I’ve made everyone that’s like kind of worked for me. Take this test. My Mom, I’ve made her take this test. Fascinating. So it will point out your top five strengths and fundamentally these are who you are as a person and your top two or your core. So mine are, I’ll give you my examples, my top one is a maximizer and my number two really right as achiever. So what’s interesting about that is I am a maximizer in life and I see it now that it’s been identified, I see it in everything that I do that can be a good or bad thing.
Rose: [40:50] So if you give me a problem, I will give you, I will find you a solution because I want to maximize the situation like okay, this isn’t working. And I’m like okay, well give me a day and I’m going to find you like nine podcast, nine different things for different options. I know how to sell this. This way we can come up with a product that way this is what doesn’t work. I will maximize and try to figure out how to achieve it. Like in anything. Even with our kid’s education, like we really struggled with trip in school his first couple of years and I’m like, this is not working in good enough is not good enough for me. I want him to have a great environment. Not that I want to, not that I don’t want him to experience things and heartache and, and you know, have to walk through those seasons with them, but I know that I want to be cultivating him and environment of success with teachers that are successful to see him grow and just the situation we’re in or it just wasn’t a good one.
Rose: [41:42] And so I’m like, we need change that, you know, like I need to maximize that, that situation. So that is just kind of how I look at everything. I get super excited, super jazzed up and I feel like there’s a way to make money and in everything, like let’s figure out how to do this. And then achiever like achievement is a big, big heart string of mind words, words of affirmation, big to me and like I want to success in the things that I do. So back to starting this business and getting back into it again. It’s like I need to feel success in this. I need that to be financial. I need that to be with our family. I need that to affect every aspect of it. Just to know that I know I’m working through some things, but I need to find achievement in it because that just fuels me and when you are in doing what you are made to do, what I feel like God has, I feel like God has created those attributes in me and I feel like he’s created attributes in everyone, but when you figure out what those are and you figure out like you’re great at this, like you are great at encouragement, you should be in some sort of role placement job where you encourage your great administration.
Rose: [42:51] You need to be in a job where you’re great at in some way. Having that kind of leadership of administration, you’re great at teaching, like you should be in it, but I feel like a lot of people don’t realize I’m probably their highest levels of like what they’re really. Their strengths are. So I think that would be. I mean the be the best piece of advice I would give people is just to figure out what those are. Read that book, take the test you. It’s like online. You can do it online. I think it’s like 20 bucks or something like that and it will tell you what, you know, what you are, good or bad, it’ll tell you what your top ones are. And I think if you live in lead into those and walk that path, I feel personally that that is the path that probably God has created you to be on and when you live in to that you’ll have the most flourishing life, if that makes sense. You know what’s interesting, uh,
Kia: [43:41] my oldest daughter is a freshman at Kansas State University and someone gifted the university that test for every freshman to take. I know. And so what’s, what I think is really fascinating about what you’re saying is that you took that test and it validated something in you that you might’ve thought was a bad thing. You know, like you like to maximize things. You’d like to grow things. You are a big achiever. And so it made you realize that you could work on those. And so when I took the test, I was really shocked actually because I thought I was that kind of person to like really like a go getter time and my first one is activator, so I’m an activator and then I don’t remember what the next was. A lot of minor like input and future and like more teaching myself things and then I like to share them.
Kia: [44:33] But what I thought was so cool about the book, and I cannot wait for you to take it, I’m going to guess what yours are going to be first, but um, is, uh, it gives you suggestions of how to work with other people, what kind of people you work best with. And it gives you suggestions of what you should do. And so what I realized when I took that test, I’m an activator and that means that you come up with an idea and then you’re ready to do it immediately. And I had all these situations in my life that I had to run every decision by all these other people and through all these other processes. And so I made all these changes in my life and then I was able to start activating on things and I was so much happier, so less much less stressed out. So yeah, I’m excited about that book and I definitely think that people should check it out. So it’s strength finders two point zero and Matt will put that in the show notes, right?
Matt: [45:30] Yeah. We’ll put that in the show notes along the same lines. That’s kind of interesting. If I can say something about sounds that I came across that’s similar to this. Um, I don’t know if any of you guys follow a Brendon burchard. He has a really interesting. He’s had some books out that are along the same lines and in his whole business was coaching people and he’s coached to like really, really big people like the oprahs of the world and stuff like that. And for a long time he just did those, the tests where he, you know, he’d give us clients test and then they’d become self aware of what, you know, their strengths and weaknesses were. And that’s, that was this whole business model for awhile. And then finally he was coaching some, you know, top 50 ceo and the CEO really pushed back and was like, hey, that’s fine, like you’re making me self aware but I need to know what to do now, what?
Matt: [46:16] And so it’s really interesting like to pair, you know, the strength, two point, oh book and test with maybe some of his stuff afterwards about like, okay, now what do you do once you know your strengths and what are some of the habits you can form and stuff like that. Because I take, I’ve taken tons of those tests. I got to that point where I was just like, okay, that’s fine. I, I know who I am now, but now what? And he did a really good job. He does a really good job of taking to the next step, which is really cool. He has a great youtube channel. He has lots of awesome books. I’ll link a couple below and stuff like that as well. So.
Kia: [46:47] Okay, well Matt, I’m going to, I’m going to guess some of yours. I’m going to look at my book and see what they are. But I’m guessing that one of yours is input, which is one of the same as mine. Like where do you like to learn about things?
Matt: [47:00] Yeah, no, I’m a, I’m a learner forever so. Okay guys, I’m going to take a total tangent so I’m going to share something with you guys real quick that you guys hold forever. Give me crap about. So I’m a bit like in the last year I’ve become a big youtuber and so like I just watch youtube all the time, like more than a mile. More than instagram, more than facebook. I’m just on Youtube. So watching. Yeah, exactly. Yes. So this thing pop this show or whatever pops up in my video pops up in my feed and it’s like the greatest ant farm ever bill. And there’s this guy in Canada, there’s this guy in Canada that literally has 2 million followers on youtube and he basically makes like a theatrical movie about his ant farms that he’s building. Oh goodness. Oh Wow. And so it was bad enough that I watched the first one that was 30 minutes, but I definitely watched like two more sense than that. Our beliefs, 30 minutes like, and I know more, I know more about ants now, like in the last week than anybody ever needs to know about ants, unless that’s your job, but you know, so that’s an example of you loving end. Exactly. Like I just can’t get enough education about even the most ridiculous things that do not pertain to my life, but I love educating myself on stuff like that. So anyways, I’m the, I guess
Rose: [48:19] learners, probably one of your top five strengths, you know, and that’s good because what’s neat about the book and they related a lot to children is like, you know, an education, you’re taught to be a very well rounded person, makes straight a’s, but your kid might be really, really good at one or two things and it’s, it was kind of like ignore the others. Not that you can’t in education, but it’s like cultivate a heart of what your strengths are and what you’re really, really good at and stop worrying about what you’re not. Just find other people to do those things and don’t worry about that. You know, you’re, you’re not meant to be mediocre at a lot of things. You’re meant to be great at the few things that God has created you to be great at. So live into that and then you’ll live, you know, better into your destiny. So
Matt: [49:02] that’s really good advice for sure. Um, so do you have any other books you want to share or is that the, is that the main one because that’s, that’s a big one and we can leave it there, but if you have any others
Rose: [49:12] and no, I would say that was my top one. I mean I love to read. I think that a lot of self help books. I just, I try to read a lot of business books but not anyone has like, hit me as most, as much as that one does. A lot of them to me just say a lot of the same information or hit like little nuggets I just watched. I just read last week girl wash your face, which was really great. But um, no, I think strengthsfinders that is just definitely my number one.
Matt: [49:41] Awesome. Okay. So we’re going to wrap it up right there and is there any parting guidance that you have to give anybody or not and I’ll also let them know how they can connect with you best.
Rose: [49:52] Yeah. Um, so you can find me online, social media, Rose Coleman, that is my instagram handle. We are business instagram handle is center stage portraits. Our website is center stage portraits.com and that is the way you can check us out. My parting piece of guidance is if for you have been doing this business and you feel like it’s not working, I would say to look, take a step back like what I did and look at your financials, look at what makes you happy in your business and figure out a way to trim the fat, trim the fat because it is not about how much money you gross. It is about how much money you keep in your pocket. So I’m, it’s funny, I just saw somebody last week on a facebook group and it was like a women’s facebook group and she was just like totally distraught.
Rose: [50:41] She’s like, the more business I get, you know, I’ve been in this for a long time. The more business I get, the more employees I had to have, the more taxes I have to pay and she’s like, I’m just over it, you know, and I’m like, girl, trim the fat. There is a way to get back to doing what you love and make money from it and be as profitable as possible so you don’t need to sell everything that the labs offer. You don’t need to do everything be just because you got a camera, you need to do what you love to do and do what makes you the most profitable. And if you look at your numbers and you look at the types of things that you sell, I figured out the one that makes you the most and cultivate that, cultivate that relationship with more of those clients.
Rose: [51:18] You know, because it’s just not. It’s not about doing more. It’s about living more into what you’re doing and that is about being profitable. It’s just about being profitable. And so there are a lot of options. I’m easy ones and hard ones to get you there and you can do and if you just take a moment to step back and kind of just live into that and work on that and figure out what that is or ask somebody there. There are ways to trim it down in order for you to make more money and then have a better, have more success with your family and your finances and things like that. So that would be my piece of the case.
Matt: [51:54] Awesome. Well thanks so much. I love to get into. No you. So when I make it through Oklahoma, I will definitely look you up because I think your business is fascinating and I think you guys really have something powerful going there and I’m really grateful that he recommended you as one of the first people we brought on the podcast because to be honest with you, I had no idea that you haven’t existed. Now I follow you on social media and stuff like that and realize how awesome what you and your husband have built so
Rose: [52:20] well. Hopefully by the time you come down we’ll have a horse barn that has been transformed into a studio space and we’ll have a lot more of land and stuff like that. You can come stay with us and yeah, it’d be fun.
Rose: [52:35] No, I think I kind of convinced my mom this morning to buy it. I was like, mother, don’t you want seven acres? Don’t you want to move? And like she’s like, I don’t know, maybe I’ll just buy it and that’ll put a house on there one day and I was like, you shut. That would be great. Just so just together. But yeah. Thank you for having me on. I’m excited that you guys are doing this. I’m excited to hear more about your podcast. Alright, thanks so much rose. All right, well thank you so much rose Coleman. We loved having you on the podcast from nothing to profit and to all of our listeners, we will have so many great links in the show notes to the things that a rose is referenced and we’ve talked about in this podcast, and we hope that you can put that to use and create profit from little or nothing.
Speaker 2: [53:28] Thank you for listening to from nothing to profit a photographer’s podcast with Matt and Kaiya. Be sure to subscribe for more business strategy and ideas to help you create the profitable and successful business you’ve always wanted. See you on the next episode of from nothing to profit.